Manipulating "damsels in distress"…

I know a healthy 55 year old woman that literally cries to try and get things done cheaper or calls family or neighbors for simple things like taking out the trash or setting a mouse trap. And she wouldn't even think about doing something like mowing her lawn or or fixing a leaky toilet (according to her thats mans work)...

It really gets under my skin when a women plays the “I’m just a helpless woman” card all the time! Come on it's the 21st century for crying out loud! I am by no means a women’s libber, but I defiantly believe in this day and age after all the demands for equality and everything- women of all ages should put on their big girl britches and do simple tasks around the house and on their cars. Open a book or learn by trial and error. As the old saying goes, Knowledge Is Power!!

What do ya'll think? Do you know any women that act like they shouldn't get their hands dirty unless they are making a garden?

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"We're all born with selfish desires, so we can all relate to those feelings in others. But kindness is something made individually by each person...so it's easy to misunderstand when others are trying to be kind to you." Natsuki

I don't know about older women, but I know a lot of girls that are exactly this way, even my little sister is. Except in my sister's case she's just lazy.

If we were cleaning desks and things at school, the girls would get disgusted. I once worked as a janitor, so it didn't matter to me to clean up. They didn't like the idea of cleaning up.. after others. I'd just glare at them and want to throw it in their faces.

My mother considers me as a whiny "princess" who hates to clean up things, which isn't true. She usually says this because I don't like doing dishes. XD (usually because my dad leaves dirty dish water in the sink for days..) I'm a real girly girl, but I have no issue with doing things. I've never heard anyone use the excuse that they're a woman not to do something, although I hear it from my boyfriend since he's old fashioned and traditional. (he thinks a woman needs to be protected. OK, maybe in my case it works for me since I'm a weakling, but I tell him not all women need that, just like how not all women need an older brother to save them. I think I grew up just fine being the eldest girl, but he still stands on his belief).

I like foreign haven't seen many older women like this but more young teenage girls too. Sometimes i feel like some teenage girls (not all, some) seem to not appreciate how hard women before them fought for rights, and why. I know quite a few few who expect to have positive (by their point of view) discrimination as well as all the equal rights in other terms. But then some find it ok to treat men as objects :/

Lol i guess what i'm trying to say is i know SOME young women who want to have their cake and eat it too. But you can't have chivalry and equal rights together.

Ok i hope i haven't wrote anything to offend anyone and i hope this wont become a big debate thread lol.

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if i start then it will be a disaster or tornedo here. so better shut up.

However i liked the thing that calforsale said. Women can not at the same time wish equality and take advantage of their woman look. Something i have been trying to say hundredth of times in women equality thread.
Better shut up right here.before.....

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Watch everything but only take the good things from it

Ask, think and learn. Because the more we know the more we grow.

Watching the wrong to happen is the same as commiting the wrong.

If it looks like things are forcing you to be creative, Then be creative.

its a uniquely Miyazaki film, one only he could make and its uniqueness places it beyond being easily critiqued.[About Porco Rosso]
taken from a quote of Saddletank and Orphic Okapi

Post last edited by saviour2012 on 08.12.2012, 07:16 AM.

quote:

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Originally posted by Calforsale

Lol i guess what i'm trying to say is i know SOME young women who want to have their cake and eat it too. But you can't have chivalry and equal rights together.

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Good point! I'll have to borrow that last line from you sometime

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"We're all born with selfish desires, so we can all relate to those feelings in others. But kindness is something made individually by each person...so it's easy to misunderstand when others are trying to be kind to you." Natsuki

I don't agree that chivalry in all its forms is incompatible with equality for women. Take opening doors for women example, a classic example of chivalry - I hold doors open for people all the time, I see it as simply a polite thing to do, I don't see why being chivalrous in such a manner would demean women at all. Equally when I'm at work I often have to live heavy boxes of rubbish and try to get into these high cages - a task for me which is extremely difficult and often painful if I drop it on myself. I don't think there's anything wrong with allowing/expecting a nearby guy who is obviously stronger and taller and could easily complete the task to help me. I'm not saying women should be put on this pedestal and helped and nurtured in every way, but it's still nice when men are respectful and helpful.

It is hugely annoying when women though, without immediate help available, feel themselves incapable of taking on an unpleasant task. You can't rely on others to help you all the time.

quote:

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Originally posted by saviour2012
if i start then it will be a disaster or tornedo here. so better shut up.

However i liked the thing that calforsale said. Women can not at the same time wish equality and take advantage of their woman look. Something i have been trying to say hundredth of times in women equality thread.
Better shut up right here.before.....

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I should mention I was also raised to behave like a "lady". :B Something a lot of girls my age weren't simply raised to do. I was also disciplined more than other girls were, and still don't have as much of the freedom some of them appear to have.

As for the chivalry stuff, I'm used to having a guy open my door and whatnot or pull out my seat for me. Well, my boyfriend does all of that, and sometimes waiters in restaurants do it for me as well, but never the other seat. I do the same though, because my mother would get mad at me if I didn't hold the door open for someone coming.

Yesterday, I moved around a bunch of heavy furniture by myself. I have no strength, but I did it. So I frown on women who give up easily and make others do everything for them. I also frown on women who can't make decisions. There is one I know of who was my friend in school. She has a son, and the father works farther away so she rarely sees him but they plan on getting married. However, she gets tired of making her own decisions. Say what? Woman, you had a child. You're an adult now. Make your own decisions! It's obvious she's a good mother to her child, but she's still living in her own world, afraid to come out and face reality. That kind of seems unrelated, but her inability to try and grow up and make her own decisions just seems like a bad mix and an unknown future for her child and fiancee. She also treats any simple bad thing that happens to her as a breakdown and complains and cries that her life is awful. Give me a break.

Most older ladies here are resilient, but now that I think about it, my boyfriend's mother and sister behave this way. They make him do everything, make him run errands and buy things for them, then complain if he's not there when they need him that second or make decisions on his behalf he doesn't want to agree to. If he locks the door when he goes out and they come, they call him and yell at him to get home that second. It's worn down him a bit, and he hates being treated this way and calls them "princesses", but not in a nice way. He can't even come see me until he's cleaned the house spotless because he'll get reprimanded. I know there's also his culture involved, but his frustration shows it's a lot more than that, and that they take advantage of him every second they can. The boy's been pushed far enough since his father died, I sometimes wonder how he handles it all.

quote:

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Originally posted by Nausicaa_Cat
I don't agree that chivalry in all its forms is incompatible with equality for women. Take opening doors for women example, a classic example of chivalry - I hold doors open for people all the time, I see it as simply a polite thing to do, I don't see why being chivalrous in such a manner would demean women at all. Equally when I'm at work I often have to live heavy boxes of rubbish and try to get into these high cages - a task for me which is extremely difficult and often painful if I drop it on myself. I don't think there's anything wrong with allowing/expecting a nearby guy who is obviously stronger and taller and could easily complete the task to help me. I'm not saying women should be put on this pedestal and helped and nurtured in every way, but it's still nice when men are respectful and helpful.

It is hugely annoying when women though, without immediate help available, feel themselves incapable of taking on an unpleasant task. You can't rely on others to help you all the time.

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"We're all born with selfish desires, so we can all relate to those feelings in others. But kindness is something made individually by each person...so it's easy to misunderstand when others are trying to be kind to you." Natsuki

Post last edited by Mokiepoet on 08.12.2012, 10:35 AM.

We all seem to be in agreement.

I do hate the idea of anything being "man's work" as you put it, Mokie.

As for chivalry... hm. Well, there's a thin and blurry line between chivalry and politeness. It's not good when its excessive, and it shouldn't be particularly expected... I don't know, my position as far as gender goes probably colours my view on it a bit, I have a friend who still insists on letting me through every door first and it gets irksome, even though he means well.

I don't know anyone who's particularly bad for abusing their position as a woman, my mother certainly never would. She's extremely independent and she's worked hard all her life. She's the family's main earner now, dad's getting old so its he and I that manage the house, though we both work a bit too.

What we're talking about here really are traditional gender roles. I feel those are quickly getting eroded with every new generation. Hopefully we as a society will move past them completely one day.

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I think everyone should be polite, friendly and helpful. But there is a difference between a man helping a woman in need as they'd to anyone in need, or helping her as she as a woman must be helped!
My point is its good for us to be helpful and polite to each other as people.

I agree with kazegami that gender roles are eroding. It'll be great when society has no gender roles what so ever, and men and women can choose to act and be how they wish without society dictating this.

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Politeness is holding a door open for anyone. Chivalry is holding a door open for a woman because she expects it.

Not really as thin a line as most people believe, but there you go. Personally, I agree that chivalry and equal rights simply don't go together, only because historically, chivalry was born under the same condition as civil manners. A lady is seen as delicate, and it is the duty of a gentleman to help a lady.

The movie "Leopold" had an excellent example of onewhere he stood up when Kate left the table. When questioned, he replied in a matter-of-fact manner, "When a lady leaves the table, you stand up."

But anyway, that's way off-topic. Let's talk about the Cinderella syndrome.

For most women, it's less of a damsel-in-distress syndrome as it is a way of getting attention. In fact, it's hardly a term limited to the fairer sex; it's a common affair across both genders of all ages.

As for how to deal with it: I don't. Simply put, I have a philosophy of doing something to the best of my abilities, and only when I cannot advance do I ask for help. Occasional small favours aside, if anyone asks me to do something they can clearly do on their own, I refuse flat out without bothering to give any explanation. If they demand for one, I just say "because you can do it yourself."

I can come across as cold because of that, but I seriously hate people who won't even try.

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I am me.
I am who I am.
I am Roarkiller.
No one else is me.

Roarkiller.net
Isakaya High RPG Site

quote:

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Originally posted by fenkashi
Screw your opinions, they are not relevant ^^.

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you should imagine me like lupin III:castle of cagliostro when he restrained his hand to hug the princess. the same way i am holding my hands back from keyboard to reply in this thread. It is so interesting but do not want this thread to be turned into debate.

__________________
Watch everything but only take the good things from it

Ask, think and learn. Because the more we know the more we grow.

Watching the wrong to happen is the same as commiting the wrong.

If it looks like things are forcing you to be creative, Then be creative.

its a uniquely Miyazaki film, one only he could make and its uniqueness places it beyond being easily critiqued.[About Porco Rosso]
taken from a quote of Saddletank and Orphic Okapi

Post last edited by saviour2012 on 08.12.2012, 02:56 PM.

@Mokie quote...
"I'm not saying women should be put on this pedestal..."
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Hi, Mokie... Your phrase struck a note with me because that is what I have been saying for most of my life, although not for the reasons given in here. As a child of 8 I sat in on MANY of my mother's little coffee klatches or 'hen party's' as they were sometimes called. There I am, sitting on the floor playing with my army men while all these conversations were going on around me with no censorship at all...Listening to these different women talk about various things was enlightening. I was even told at times to stand up and tell my own little 'dirty' joke, which I will not go into here... They all laughed, but I don't think they realized that I understood the content of my 'little joke'.

I learned a lot about women from these sessions and I have said, Yes, I respect women for the child-bearers that they are and for the problems connected with being a woman that they endure, but I will never put a woman on a pedestal because I have seen the real nature of 'woman' and, in many ways, it is not that different from me... I, myself, have never struck a woman in anger, ever. I have defended myself while working as a security officer and got into a couple of scuffles, but that was business, not anger. Even then, it was mostly wrestling them to the floor to gain control or handcuffing as was sometimes necessary.

Now, I am not saying that all women are the same as those I listened to as a child, but there has been enough coorroboration (sic) over the years to generally substantiate my personal views... to me, at least.

Some of those jokes they, the purer sex , told would have made a sailor blush... lol

I figure that they thought that I didn't know what they were talking about, but I, at 8, knew far more than they realized, because of my own mother's openness with me about the 'facts of life', etc... Remember, this was the mid-50's and boys my age were generally clueless about the opposite sex or life in general. Thank goodness I had the mother I did... Gone now, but never forgotten...


anyway, sorry for the length of my post, but I just got caught up in the memories...

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Post last edited by husky51 on 08.12.2012, 03:08 PM.

Personally speaking, due to my parents divorcing whilst I was still little my mother raised me and my five other siblings by herself. I remember how late she used to get home every night during the week, and yet she still managed to take care of all of us (and me and my younger brother were under six years old at the time) so I like to think I know independent women. I've been raised to take care of myself and not rely too much on others.

However, I guess women who are raised from when they are very little to expect aid and help - to know that they can manipulate others using their own 'helplessness' they probably wouldn't know any better. I remember my next door neighbours had a young girl my age, back when I was about 10, whose mother used to wipe her butt for her. She'd just call her mum for help and her mum would come do it. Which in retrospect is super bizarre ahaha, but regardless she'd probably grow up thinking it was acceptable to be so dependent on others. There's always reasons for how people behave.

quote:

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Originally posted by Roarkiller
Politeness is holding a door open for anyone. Chivalry is holding a door open for a woman because she expects it.

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Isakaya High School Roleplaying Info

"An old man like me stands no chance fighting against a high school girl in her underwear" - Oshino Meme, Nekomonogatari (Kuro)

Saddletank quote:
"We simply now just have politeness and being decent and a woman should both not expect a door to be opened for her, nor take sexist insult when one is."

I agree with you there, Saddles...

I was raised by 'chivalry' standards. A man opens a door for a lady, lets her go first thru a door, walks next to the curb when walking together on a sidewalk so I do these things automatically, without giving the whys and wherefores much thought. If I see a woman approaching a doorway that I am about to go through, I will usually stand and wait, holding the door open, I don't even think twice about it, it's an automatic reaction.

On the other hand, if I see a guy approaching, I might do the same thing out of politeness, maybe not. A lot might depend on my mood at the time. If I am in line at the grocery store and someone behind only has an item or two, I will frequently let them go ahead, or if they have a heavy item, let them place it on my cart until they can reach the check-out counter...

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quote:

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As for how to deal with it: I don't. Simply put, I have a philosophy of doing something to the best of my abilities, and only when I cannot advance do I ask for help. Occasional small favours aside, if anyone asks me to do something they can clearly do on their own, I refuse flat out without bothering to give any explanation. If they demand for one, I just say "because you can do it yourself."

I can come across as cold because of that, but I seriously hate people who won't even try.

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Often I do just tell her no, but her son, some of her nieghbors and most of her friends are so used to her demands that they either (A) don't answer their phones (B) just agree to the task or (C) stop being friends with her.
Nausicaa_Cat said everybody has a reason, but I'm not sure why this womans is the way she is... Her only sibling was 10 years older than her and it's my understanding growing up he never really gave her the time of day, her father was an alcoholic and died when she was 9, her mother though, was a very headstrong woman, she owned/operated grass business for over 30 years-she did hard labor on the job.
I'll just tell ya'll, the woman I am refering to is my x-husbands mother, her and I are better friends now than we were the whole 9 years her son & I were together...go figure. Anyways I have 3 daughters and they get aggravated with her too. I try to teach my girls to be independent and self reliant. When I change the oil on my truck, do a tune up, use a circular saw or just paint a room, at least 1 of my daughters is around to help/learn.... I gotta say my main reason for doing this is because I do not want them end up like my mother in-law...
Stepping off my soapbox now!

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"We're all born with selfish desires, so we can all relate to those feelings in others. But kindness is something made individually by each person...so it's easy to misunderstand when others are trying to be kind to you." Natsuki

Post last edited by Mokiepoet on 08.19.2012, 06:53 PM.