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husky51
The Old Guy
Registration Date: 03.17.08
Location: Southern California
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 09.14.2013, 11:36 PM |
   
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saviour2012
Baron
Registration Date: 02.24.12
Location: Dhaka,Bangladesh
Posts: 1749 |
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@Roarkiller
I think the majority will be always right if they are informed correctly. Majority might do a big mistake,is not very likely. It is very easy if you try to take an action for the good of human kind.
@Mush
I do not want you to do anything extraordinary. Now that you understood or you already knew, i want you just to discuss this with your friends and family and make them understand what you understand. Maybe someone of them or someone friends of them will have power to bring about a change.
But right now it is enough to acknowledge that govts are doing many very wrong things around the world. But most of the people do not even acknowledge that.
edit:
But it's not like the
government rolls through
these protests with tanks
and shoots people to get
them to stop protesting.
(Usually).
occupy wallstreet?
I thought i said enough but there is a small(actually very big) thing. The thing is America and its allies do war just for their interest not for the people or democracy. It is the greatest lie that govt tell to people. These are just a lame excuse for war. Because Saddam killed thosand by chemical gas(iran-iraq war) US said nothing. In my country there is a islamic political party which killed hundreds of people protesting but US recognises them as a modern islamic party. so yes working humanity and demicracy is nothing but a joke.
__________________
Watch everything but only take the good things from it
Ask, think and learn. Because the more we know the more we grow.
Watching the wrong to happen is the same as commiting the wrong.
If it looks like things are forcing you to be creative, Then be creative.
its a uniquely Miyazaki film, one only he could make and its uniqueness places it beyond being easily critiqued.[About Porco Rosso]
taken from a quote of Saddletank and Orphic Okapi
Post last edited by saviour2012 on 09.15.2013, 09:14 AM.
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| 09.14.2013, 11:48 PM |
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Saddletank
Miyazaki's Best Friend
Registration Date: 09.28.06
Location: On your case
Posts: 10069 |
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quote:
Originally posted by saviour2012
@Roarkiller
I think the majority will be always right if they are informed correctly. Majority might do a big mistake,is not very likely. It is very easy if you try to take an action for the good of human kind.
The USA went to war against Saddam Hussein because the "majority" thought it was right. Turns out there was an overwhelming desire among the hawks in the govt to go to war and they manufactured information to support their wish to do so, or simply ignored contrary information.
How can a majority of people fully understand anything and make informed decisions about anything with governments this corrupt?
I wouldn't say that democracy is "nothing but a joke", at least in a democracy you are free to disagree; to try to change things. In many fundamentalist states and dictatorships you are not.
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Isakaya High School Roleplaying Info
"An old man like me stands no chance fighting against a high school girl in her underwear" - Oshino Meme, Nekomonogatari (Kuro)
Post last edited by Saddletank on 09.15.2013, 10:24 AM.
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| 09.15.2013, 10:22 AM |
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Roarkiller
Your Daddy-O
Registration Date: 06.03.03
Location: Home, resting...
Posts: 6077 |
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quote:
Originally posted by saviour2012
@Roarkiller
I think the majority will be always right if they are informed correctly. Majority might do a big mistake,is not very likely.
That is a VERY big if.
And even when true, history has proven you wrong already. Two phrases to get acquainted with: "self interest" and "group think". The latter is especially lethal.
In one anime, there was one scene that explains a psychological example. A teacher asks a question, which you know the answer to be (X). The first person to answer, however, says (Y). The next person also says (Y). And the next. And the next.
When it finally comes to your turn, you become very hesitant to answer (X), and most probably will also say (Y), because of fear that you may be wrong, or afraid to be different.
It takes a lot of courage and conviction to point out the mistakes of the people before us, and especially the people who are more senior or smarter than us. And this reason is why "majority rules" is more often really just an illusion than fact.
Or, for people like me, complete ignorance to any form of superiority.
__________________
I am me.
I am who I am.
I am Roarkiller.
No one else is me.
Roarkiller.net
Isakaya High RPG Site
quote:
Originally posted by fenkashi
Screw your opinions, they are not relevant ^^.
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| 09.15.2013, 11:58 AM |
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Mush
Baron
Registration Date: 07.30.07
Location: South of Canada
Posts: 1810 |
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quote:
I think the majority will be always right if they are informed correctly. Majority might do a big mistake,is not very likely.
It happens all the time; one example is the tragedy of the commons. Even when every individual has complete and accurate information, they can still end up making choices that hurt everybody (including themselves), because what makes sense for an individual does not make sense for a group.
As for Occupy -- that's why I said usually.  But even the worst crackdowns that occurred during Occupy were nowhere near as repressive as the Syrian government's attacks on protesters, or China's Tiennanmen Square massacre. They just received a lot more attention from the media, because they occurred in the USA. Isn't it interesting to think about how that fits with your hypothesis? quote:
The thing is America and its allies do war just for their interest not for the people or democracy. It is the greatest lie that govt tell to people. These are just a lame excuse for war.
I agree, but I just want to make sure you know that you're basically preaching to the choir. That 'spreading democracy' is a blatant lie told by the US government is common knowledge in the West. It was even taught in my high school curriculum, along with a list of cases where the USA/CIA suppressed democratic revolutions in order to install USA-friendly authoritarian governments. In the cases where the USA actually genuinely wants to foster democracy, it's almost always because the existing government is unfriendly to the USA or to US businesses.
I just think it's important that you know this, so that you have a clearer understanding of the level of skepticism that Westerners hold toward the actions of their own government. Your opinion is basically mainstream.
Just to add to what Saddles said, another major reason that the US public supported the invasion of Iraq was because the September 11th attacks were in recent public memory. These attacks significantly increased the amount of military action that the public was willing to support, and reduced the amount of rational discussion. When Bush claimed that Saddam Hussein was harbouring al-Qaeda, the response was "alright then let's invade Iraq!" instead of "wait, that doesn't make any sense". I guess people who have been hurt don't think too clearly.
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Post last edited by Mush on 09.15.2013, 01:41 PM.
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| 09.15.2013, 01:24 PM |
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Koda
Ohmu
Registration Date: 07.09.13
Location: England
Posts: 454 |
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I probably would of participated, in this rather fun discussion or debate if you will earlier, but I generally didn't know what I could add.
I think it starts from a young age, I am not really a believer of the idea we make our own decisions.
Just look at the Riots we had in London and across the country a few summers ago. Some of the people participating, were just standard teenagers. When someone sees someone do something, they want to do it as well. It shows humans, are all the same, we think and do the same. We have patterns.
So the idea that, the majority is right, well that's just irrelevant. We know that isn't true, there isn't any evidence to back such a claim.
__________________
"A loving heart is the beginning of all knowledge
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| 09.16.2013, 01:26 AM |
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saviour2012
Baron
Registration Date: 02.24.12
Location: Dhaka,Bangladesh
Posts: 1749 |
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It is a belief of mine that majority are good, it gives me hope so i would like to keep this. The thought that majority may be evil [that is what most south asian think in case of west] gives me the chills.
I agree with the facts that what mush and roar said. And it is also seen in history. But i had two points
1.Distribute accurate information to the general people
2.It has to be for the good of the people [all people]
You missed the second one.
@Mush
I do not consider china or syria to be good. they are much more oppressive towards their people than many of the western countries. Western countries are not oppressive right now but it is only a matter of time when they will. i think its inevitable.
But in USA or UK that[major protests] thing happened by young people and is influenced very much by internet.You have to understand govt do not ever deny the power of people.
These were a start. And it was bottled up before it could spread. And now after they control internet information it is very likely that it wont happen again. Controlling info will make people act or react to a incident with much less importance.
In computer science we have a word called big data. It is a complex data system that can manipulate or give a vision[computer vision that is] using algorithms and other factors. Now all the western countries already had too much information on public behavior or pattern [different types:social,economic,traffic etc etc] and one after another opening of the big data centers all over the world will create a network that will enable the people in power to manipulate information and then predict what kind of effect it might have in people. You might think its all science fiction, yes i agree it is not like neon genesis type computing, but it is in effect and will be in much more stronger position in future for decision making. As i have been working on a project about traffic jam[tragedy of commons problem] i studied a lot about big data and its implementation. So the things i said about information control, censorship etc etc will get even more prevalent.
So i am very much afraid that the positive wave that general young people who did something other than playing games did know something. If they stop this then they will do whatever they want.
now that i said it, it makes me want to make a list of pictures of many things that turned into reality from science fiction anime.there is so many things i want to do but no time.
And about govt and people relationship[that you said the idea of mine is common] these are quotes that i stored a long time ago.
comedian george carlin
quote:
Hello! Thank you, thank you. Thank you and hello New York! OK. It has been a little while, since I have been here and a couple of things has happened in that time I like to talk a little bit about the war in the Persian Gulf. Big two ones in the Persian Gulf. You know my favorite part of that war? It is the first war we ever had, it was on every channel, plus cable. And the war got good ratings too, didn't it? Got good ratings. Well, we like war. We like war, we are war like people. We like war, because we are good at it. You know why we are good at it? Because we did a lot of practice. This country is only 200 years old and already we have had 10 major wars. We average a major war every 20 years in this country, so we are good at it! And that is good thing we are, we are not very good in anything else anymore. Can't built a decent car, can't make a TV set or VCR where the fuck. Got no steel industry left, can't educate our young people can't get health care for our old people, but we can bomb the **** out of your country alright?! Especially if your country is full of brown people. Oh, we like that, don't we? That's our hobby! That's our new job in the world, bombing brown people! Iraq, Panama, Granada, Libya, you got some brown people in your country, tell them to watch the **** out or we will god damn bomb them! Well, when is the last white people you can remember that we bombed. Can you remember the last white people? Can you remember any white people, we have ever bombed? The Germans! Those are the only ones and that is only because they were trying to cutting in our action. They wanted to dominate the world! Bullshit! That's our ******* job! Now, we only bomb brown people. Not because they are trying to cutting in our action, just because they are brown. You probably noticed that I don't feel about that war the way we were told, we were supposed to feel about that war, the way we were ordered and instructed by the USA government to feel about that war. You see, I tell you, my mind does not work that way. I got this real moron thing I do, its called thinking and I am not a very good American, because I like to form my own opinions! I don't just roll over when I am told to. Sad to say most Americans just roll over on command. Not me. I have certain rules I live buy. My first rule: I don't believe anything the government tells me. Nothing. Zero. Nope. And I don't take very seriously the media or the press in this country who in the case of the Persian Gulf war were nothing more than unpaid employees of the Department of Defense and who most of the time, most of the time function as kind of unofficial public relations agency for the US government. So I don't listen to them, I don't really believe in my country and I got to tell you folks, I don't get all choked up about yellow ribbons and American flags. I consider them to be symbols and I leave symbols to the symbol minded. Me, I look at war a little bit differently. To me war is a lot of prick waving. OK? Simple thing that's all it is. War is a whole lot of men standing out on the field waving their pricks in one another. Men are insecure about the size of their dicks and so they have to kill one another over the idea. That's what all that asshole jack bullshit is all about. That is what all that adolescent macho-male posturing and strutting in bars and locker rooms is all about. It is called dick fear. Men are terrified that their pricks are inadequate and so they have to compete with one another to feel better about themselves and since war is the ultimate competition basically men are killing each other in order to improve their self-esteem. You do not have to be a historian or political scientist to see the bigger dick foreign policy theory at work. It sounds like this: What? They have bigger dicks?! Bomb them! And off course the bombs and the rockets and the bullets are all shaped like dicks. It is a subconscious need to project the ***** into other peoples' affairs. It is called ******* WITH PEOPLE! So, as far as I am concerned that whole thing in Persian Gulf is nothing more than biig prick-waving dick fight. In this particular case Saddam Husein had questioned the size of George Bush's dick. And George Bush has been called "The Wimp" for so long wimp rhymes with limp George has been called The Wimp for so long that he has to act down his men with fantasies by sending other people's children to die. Even the name - BUSH is related to the genitals without being the genitals. A bush is a sort of passive secondary sex characteristic. Now, if this man's name had been George Boner... Well he might have feel a little bit better about himself and we would not had any trouble over there in the first place. This whole country has a manhood problem. Big manhood problem in the USA You can tell from the language we use. Language always gives you way. What did we do wrong in the Vietnam? We pulled out! Not a very manly thing to do, is it? Would you a ******* people, you got to stay in there and **** them good, **** them all the way! **** until the end. Stay in there and keep ******* them until they are all dead! We left a few women and children alive in Vietnam, and we have not felt good about ourselves since. That is why in the Persian Gulf George Bush had to say "This will not be another Vietnam!" He actually used these words, he said: "This time we are going all the way!" Imagine American president using the sexual slang of a thirteen year old to describe his foreign policy. If you want to know what happened in the Persian Gulf just remember the names of the two men who were running that war, Dick Cheney and Collin Powell. Somebody got fucked in the ass! Well, I tell you what. Now to balance the scale I would like to talk about some things that bring us together. Things that point out our similarities instead of our differences, because that's what you have been hearing in this country. Our differences that is all the media and the politicians are ever talking about things that separate us, things that make us different from one another. That is the way the ruling class operates in any society. They try to divide the rest of the people. They keep the lower and the middle classes fighting with each other, so that they the rich can run off with all the ******* money. Fairly simple thing, happens to work. You know, anything different that is what they are gonna talk about. Race, religion, ethnic and national background, jobs, income, education, social status, sexuality, anything they can do to keep us fighting with each other so that they can keep going to the bank. You know how I describe the economic and social classes in this country?
business analyst Paul Farrell wrote during this Iraq War.
quote:
"Deep inside we love war. We want war. Need it. Relish it. Thrive on war. War is in our genes, deep in our DNA. War excites our economic brain. War drives our entrepreneurial spirit. War thrills the American soul. Oh just admit it, we have a love affair with war."
Basically you are saying that these are correct.
That is exactly what my countrymen says to me.my brother[younger] says war is just like first person shooting to us military.
@Saddle
quote:
How can a majority of people fully understand anything and make informed decisions about anything with governments this corrupt? I wouldn't say that democracy is "nothing but a joke", at least in a democracy you are free to disagree; to try to change things. In many fundamentalist states and dictatorships you are not.
when we are going to change saddle when.
We most of us here are young people and elite people.It is us that will be in power for the upcoming years. We have already too much problem in our hand that we must try to complete[fix] these jobs[climate change, energy crisis, food shortage, pollution] hand in hand. If we still go in war and destroy everything then what will be the benefit. Why we should not start to change even if it is little. A little knowledge sharing, a little discussion is that little step. I know its hard and will have an affect on your reputation. Businessmen will always want to manipulate market and people for benefit that is why our prophet[peace be upon him] said"An honest and trustworthy merchant shall be with the Ambiya (Prophets) and the Martyrs and the pious men in the judgement day". That is a very big prize.We can not allow businessmen to do as they wish.
I think we must think about these things and not just ignore them we have to take responsibility even it means hardship. We must not run.
Because i do not want a big war in my lifetime.
__________________
Watch everything but only take the good things from it
Ask, think and learn. Because the more we know the more we grow.
Watching the wrong to happen is the same as commiting the wrong.
If it looks like things are forcing you to be creative, Then be creative.
its a uniquely Miyazaki film, one only he could make and its uniqueness places it beyond being easily critiqued.[About Porco Rosso]
taken from a quote of Saddletank and Orphic Okapi
Post last edited by saviour2012 on 09.16.2013, 02:56 AM.
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| 09.16.2013, 02:43 AM |
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Saddletank
Miyazaki's Best Friend
Registration Date: 09.28.06
Location: On your case
Posts: 10069 |
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quote:
Originally posted by saviour2012 But i had two points
1.Distribute accurate information to the general people
2.It has to be for the good of the people [all people]
You missed the second one.
And there is the problem. When a government is in power and has an agenda (such as the Bush administration in the early 2000s and the Nazis in the 1920s and 1930s) it isn't going to give its people the truth; its going to do the exact opposite so that its agenda doesn't seem like an agenda.
Point 2 falls by the wayside when point 1 is broken.
BTW, we seem to have drifted a long way from "censorship of the internet in the west" which is where this topic started. My assertion that governments in Europe and N America are not censoring the internet is still as strong as ever and no data so far presented even dents my belief. The proposal of Cameron's government to put in pornography filters is still not censorship since customers have the choice to enable them or disable them.
__________________
Isakaya High School Roleplaying Info
"An old man like me stands no chance fighting against a high school girl in her underwear" - Oshino Meme, Nekomonogatari (Kuro)
Post last edited by Saddletank on 09.16.2013, 11:15 AM.
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| 09.16.2013, 11:12 AM |
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saviour2012
Baron
Registration Date: 02.24.12
Location: Dhaka,Bangladesh
Posts: 1749 |
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quote:
Originally posted by Saddletank
Point 2 falls by the wayside when point 1 is broken.
BTW, we seem to have drifted a long way from "censorship of the internet in the west" which is where this topic started. My assertion that governments in Europe and N America are not censoring the internet is still as strong as ever and no data so far presented even dents my belief. The proposal of Cameron's government to put in pornography filters is still not censorship since customers have the choice to enable them or disable them.
How? Then you actually have to say that the people in power wants to fulfill their desire. But that is not for mankind or for the good of ll people. You can not deny that you need to put good people on power, if democracy can not do that then we have to invent or innovate a newer one.
Please saddle can you provide any facts behind that belief of yours other than govt speeches. Please provide. Maybe i might get a new idea about this thing.
From my perspective[ as a computer engineering student] i am almost fully sure that is what will be [or is] happening in the next few years. If there is no obligation you can just manipulate data anyhow you want and no one will even notice the difference if done properly. For a simple example Google priority search. It is based on your preference[pattern or behavior] but not specified by you[most of it] so it is possible for you to see something that will be never shown to me or vice-verse. That is just one example, science fictions are not wrong about puppet master program[right now not literally] , it is just there are some problems in the AI system which will be solved eventually after invention of quantum algorithms in the field.I do not see any point of comforting myself that everything is alright if it is not.
__________________
Watch everything but only take the good things from it
Ask, think and learn. Because the more we know the more we grow.
Watching the wrong to happen is the same as commiting the wrong.
If it looks like things are forcing you to be creative, Then be creative.
its a uniquely Miyazaki film, one only he could make and its uniqueness places it beyond being easily critiqued.[About Porco Rosso]
taken from a quote of Saddletank and Orphic Okapi
Post last edited by saviour2012 on 09.16.2013, 03:01 PM.
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| 09.16.2013, 02:54 PM |
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Saddletank
Miyazaki's Best Friend
Registration Date: 09.28.06
Location: On your case
Posts: 10069 |
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quote:
Originally posted by saviour2012 Please saddle can you provide any facts behind that belief of yours other than govt speeches. Please provide. Maybe i might get a new idea about this thing.
You are the one who opened the subject by asserting that there is censorship in European countries and N America by their governments of the internet (not in this thread, in another converation ages ago). You have yet to provide any evidence of this assertion.
__________________
Isakaya High School Roleplaying Info
"An old man like me stands no chance fighting against a high school girl in her underwear" - Oshino Meme, Nekomonogatari (Kuro)
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| 09.16.2013, 03:45 PM |
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saviour2012
Baron
Registration Date: 02.24.12
Location: Dhaka,Bangladesh
Posts: 1749 |
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quote:
Originally posted by Saddletank
quote:
Originally posted by saviour2012 Please saddle can you provide any facts behind that belief of yours other than govt speeches. Please provide. Maybe i might get a new idea about this thing.
You are the one who opened the subject by asserting that there is censorship in European countries and N America by their governments of the internet (not in this thread, in another converation ages ago). You have yet to provide any evidence of this assertion.
i have provided facts.
if i could provide proof then i would not have to be discussing this matter with you because then it would have been already proved true.
But i have not found anything that can make me understand why you believe that other than loyalty or blind trust.
__________________
Watch everything but only take the good things from it
Ask, think and learn. Because the more we know the more we grow.
Watching the wrong to happen is the same as commiting the wrong.
If it looks like things are forcing you to be creative, Then be creative.
its a uniquely Miyazaki film, one only he could make and its uniqueness places it beyond being easily critiqued.[About Porco Rosso]
taken from a quote of Saddletank and Orphic Okapi
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| 09.17.2013, 02:23 AM |
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Saddletank
Miyazaki's Best Friend
Registration Date: 09.28.06
Location: On your case
Posts: 10069 |
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quote:
Originally posted by saviour2012
i have provided facts.
Where? I don't see a single reference to government-sponsored censorship.
Unless we are misunderstanding the meaning of words again?
__________________
Isakaya High School Roleplaying Info
"An old man like me stands no chance fighting against a high school girl in her underwear" - Oshino Meme, Nekomonogatari (Kuro)
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| 09.17.2013, 12:03 PM |
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saviour2012
Baron
Registration Date: 02.24.12
Location: Dhaka,Bangladesh
Posts: 1749 |
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quote:
Originally posted by Saddletank
Where? I don't see a single reference to government-sponsored censorship.
Unless we are misunderstanding the meaning of words again?
what do you mean !!!
in fact this thread has plenty of them snowden incident, wikileaks incident and the recent talks about spying on person level are all indications that there is a scheme of censorship behind the scene. Government could not stop any of the incident just because of internet. If there was no internet then they could have stop that and now i would have to deal with you about the fact that west does conspiracy internationally[which is now proven] then you would have said again that i do not have any proof. You can say it information manipulation if it suites your taste but does not make a difference. All the recent government moves and the truth behind that informs me govt did say nothing but lies to the people . you want a direct implication[not proof] that government wants to censor internet right?
well i am on it. if it is still here[on internet]
__________________
Watch everything but only take the good things from it
Ask, think and learn. Because the more we know the more we grow.
Watching the wrong to happen is the same as commiting the wrong.
If it looks like things are forcing you to be creative, Then be creative.
its a uniquely Miyazaki film, one only he could make and its uniqueness places it beyond being easily critiqued.[About Porco Rosso]
taken from a quote of Saddletank and Orphic Okapi
Post last edited by saviour2012 on 09.17.2013, 01:38 PM.
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| 09.17.2013, 12:38 PM |
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Mush
Baron
Registration Date: 07.30.07
Location: South of Canada
Posts: 1810 |
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quote:
Originally posted by saviour2012
Government could not stop any of the incident just because of internet. If there was no internet then they could have stop that
Do I follow your logic correctly?
Claim: If the government censored the internet, Wikileaks would not be able to publish their files, and Snowden would not have been able to distribute confidential NSA information.
Observation: Wikileaks was able to publish their files, and Snowden was able to distribute confidential NSA information.
Conclusion: The government censors the internet.
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| 09.17.2013, 02:42 PM |
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saviour2012
Baron
Registration Date: 02.24.12
Location: Dhaka,Bangladesh
Posts: 1749 |
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| 09.17.2013, 03:42 PM |
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Saddletank
Miyazaki's Best Friend
Registration Date: 09.28.06
Location: On your case
Posts: 10069 |
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quote:
Originally posted by saviour2012
what do you mean !!!
in fact this thread has plenty of them snowden incident, wikileaks incident and the recent talks about spying on person level are all indications that there is a scheme of censorship behind the scene.
That is one huge unsubstantiated assumption. There is spying yes, but no evidence whatsover of censorship, which has been my point (and others) all along.
I made the point several posts ago that if certain bodies are spying via the internet then censorship is actually against their interests since they surely want to collect data on people and organisations that are going to illegal websites (among other things).
Only YOU are saying that western govts are censoring the internet and there's not a single scrap of evidence to support that assertion.
quote:
Originally posted by saviour2012
did i say govt censors internet right now.
Yes, you did, numerous times.
Its why we are having this discussion.
If you didn't say that then we can close this discussion and move on because then you and I would be saying the same thing.
If censorship happens in the future, then it happens in the future. No-one can predict that and I'm not suggesting that there will be no censorship of the internet by western govts at some future time.
Remember this all started out of Fenkashi's remarks about her trip to China where she gave evidence of how much the Chinese govt censors the internet there. In the west there is no censorship, at least at the state level (there is at privately run ISP level).
__________________
Isakaya High School Roleplaying Info
"An old man like me stands no chance fighting against a high school girl in her underwear" - Oshino Meme, Nekomonogatari (Kuro)
Post last edited by Saddletank on 09.17.2013, 05:30 PM.
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| 09.17.2013, 05:24 PM |
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husky51
The Old Guy
Registration Date: 03.17.08
Location: Southern California
Posts: 12799 |
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| 09.17.2013, 06:07 PM |
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Calforsale
Totoro
Registration Date: 01.19.10
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 866 |
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Australia has a significant level of censorship for a western nation, such as some (what wouldve been) high rated video games and movies.
There were some plans to censor child pornography here which wouldve along the way banned a few other sites accidentally but it didnt end up getting implemented.
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| 09.17.2013, 09:29 PM |
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saviour2012
Baron
Registration Date: 02.24.12
Location: Dhaka,Bangladesh
Posts: 1749 |
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quote:
Originally posted by Saddletank
Yes, you did, numerous times.
No i did not.I never said there is a great level of censorship in internet. that is why i love internet. there is of course censorship in west[it can stop many many sites but then again you can bypass it by proxies vpns etc means] in internet but you said there is no censorship at all those are very different statements. But my current post is not about that.It is about global scale information manipulation they now can even get into vpn and proxies. I do not know if you understand what that kind of power that suggests.
quote:
That is one huge unsubstantiated assumption. There is spying yes, but no evidence whatsover of censorship, which has been my point (and others) all along.
what are you talking about AGAIN. if there is evidence then that IS proved. are you trying to be naive?
see the links i gave you. they have so many points that will blow your mind about your govt.
other thoughts:
there are several engineering conferences called in just because of these. I do not want to discuss details as they are about how to get past NSA. Western internet backbone is the heart and brain of internet. all of my servers are in us. and i do not have a alternative right now. USA tech business is doomed just because of that.I will be creating my own mail server and probably wont use yahoo gmail for now. Open source age is coming that is very good. Goodbye copyright. Now anyone just can not say my tech is good they have to prove it.
adding prism full form in the wikisite lets see what happens.
edit: cant edit that without showing my real ip. well i do not want to be in their direct watch-list. 
anyone brave enough?
edit: I wont lose hope
there are still some people who might be worth loving.
__________________
Watch everything but only take the good things from it
Ask, think and learn. Because the more we know the more we grow.
Watching the wrong to happen is the same as commiting the wrong.
If it looks like things are forcing you to be creative, Then be creative.
its a uniquely Miyazaki film, one only he could make and its uniqueness places it beyond being easily critiqued.[About Porco Rosso]
taken from a quote of Saddletank and Orphic Okapi
Post last edited by saviour2012 on 09.18.2013, 08:04 AM.
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| 09.18.2013, 03:38 AM |
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Saddletank
Miyazaki's Best Friend
Registration Date: 09.28.06
Location: On your case
Posts: 10069 |
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quote:
Originally posted by saviour2012
quote:
Originally posted by Saddletank
Yes, you did, numerous times.
No i did not.
I give up. What have we been arguing about for the last couple of months if you didn't say this? Why have you written the title of this thread so as to suggest that they do?
quote:
Originally posted by saviour2012 I never said there is a great level of censorship in internet.
I never claimed you said that either. You said "in the west governments censor the internet".
I am disagreeing with you.
@ Husky & Cal - sure, we safeguard our minors from adult themes in many walks of life, but that is not what this particular discussion is about.
It's about:
1) Western countries.
2) The internet only, not any other media.
3) State-controlled censorship.
Saviour is saying it exists. I'm saying it doesn't. He is unable to provide evidence to support his claim.
quote:
Originally posted by saviour2012 quote:
That is one huge unsubstantiated assumption. There is spying yes, but no evidence whatsover of censorship, which has been my point (and others) all along.
what are you talking about AGAIN. if there is evidence then that IS proved. are you trying to be naive?
see the links i gave you. they have so many points that will blow your mind about your govt.
I followed many of them. They all focus on spying and information gathering, NOT censorship.
I am beginning to truly beleive that you do not understand the difference in meaning between the words "spying" and "censoring".
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"An old man like me stands no chance fighting against a high school girl in her underwear" - Oshino Meme, Nekomonogatari (Kuro)
Post last edited by Saddletank on 09.18.2013, 09:36 PM.
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| 09.18.2013, 09:19 PM |
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