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Nausicaa_Cat
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Registration Date: 10.02.06
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Hey guys, so I was thinking earlier about those classic tropes which appear over and over again in anime - especially that of the high school genre. Things like, for example, beach/festival/fireworks episodes, step-sibling love, misadventures in love hotels, half-European characters (particularly blonde, blue-eyed), amusement park dates etc.
You know what kind of thing I'm referring to, the kind of stuff which manages to find its way into even seemingly unconventional stories.
What I was wondering about also was the degree to which these things actually reflect any realistic element of modern Japanese life and whether anybody can shed much light on that.
For example, I was thinking about how at some point a character always gets caught on the rain and as a result gets a fever. It would appear that anytime spent in the rain will always result in a fever which incapacitates that person for at least 24 hours and will require plenty of medicine and often a hospital visit. Now, I know this was exaggerated, but does this reflect in some small way a Japanese attitude towards illness? Is it taken more seriously than perhaps in the west?
Genuinely curious to what degree these things are in anyway realistic.
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 11.15.2013, 12:06 PM |
  
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Saddletank
Miyazaki's Best Friend
Registration Date: 09.28.06
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Good idea for a thread. Yes the catching a cold because you are cold and wet idea is really weird, considering that colds are caused by an infection from bacteria and the weather has nothing to do with it.
The cold though usually results in an opportunity for the best friend or the one in love with the ill person (but too shy to mention it) visiting them at home to give them some school work. This then results in some Unexpected Fanservice with an older sibling or some Relationship Confusion because someone else sees the visitor going in/leaving the house or some other silly event that just makes things more problematic. I'm thinking the 'gets caught in the rain and is at home ill' thing isn't realistic but just a common story device in romance comedies.
Another trope I wondered about was how, in so many high school anime, there seems to be so much formality to couples forming and romance blossoming. The confession letter in the shoe locker, or being handed to the one you have a crush on by your friend seems to be the standard way to get a BF or GF. How true is this?
Another is the huge emphasis placed on the fabled First Kiss. Do Japanese teenagers really think this way? Its curious.
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"An old man like me stands no chance fighting against a high school girl in her underwear" - Oshino Meme, Nekomonogatari (Kuro)
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| 11.15.2013, 03:28 PM |
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Orphic Okapi
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Registration Date: 04.08.07
Location: Saskatchewan
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I don't know how familiar I am with these tropes, since none of the anime I watch seem to be set in high school. But I can try to shed a little light on some of the things you've brought up.
Japanese people do seem to be a little paranoid about catching colds. The phrase "kaze o hiku" (meaning "catch a cold") gets thrown around on a nearly daily basis, it seems. I think the misconception that you can catch a cold from getting cold/wet is not unique to Japan, though. I was told the same thing as a kid. It's a pretty widespread myth.
As for going to the hospital over a minor thing like a cold, I'm also pretty sure that's a real part of Japanese life. Wikipeda claims that Japanese go to the hospital about four times as often as the average American, which can sometimes result in problematic supply shortages. The healthcare system here makes hospital visits really cheap, and I guess people take advantage of that.
I have absolutely no idea how romance plays out in school. Keep in mind that I teach middle school, not high school, where relationships are probably more prevalent. My middle school students are either not dating, or really good at concealing it. I never see any kids holding hands, and the genders seem to stay mostly pretty segregated.
The first kiss thing might be a big deal in anime just because kissing in general is a bigger deal in Japan. From what I gather it's considered a much more intimate act than it is in the West, to the point where parents would never kiss in front of their kids. It seems like the first kiss is treated as being paramount to losing your virginity.
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Post last edited by Orphic Okapi on 11.16.2013, 05:38 AM.
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| 11.16.2013, 05:36 AM |
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arren18
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Registration Date: 08.15.06
Location: Edinburgh
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I was going to say the same as Orphic regarding catching colds. The idea that you get them just from getting wet and cold is popular the world over.
As for the confession letter thing - I can see that being true. I'm aware of the idea of a "confession of love" being very important, not in order to move the relationship on to a different level, but to get into one in the first place. Actually I read an article about that recently if you're interested: http://www.tofugu.com/2013/10/23/japans-...essing-culture/ Anyway, based on that, I can believe that doing it through letters would be common as a means of getting around the potential embarrassment of doing it face-to-face, with someone you might not even know that well.
And let's not forget that much-loved trope of running late for school and having to eat your toast on the way there! http://unit03.tumblr.com/post/41000232797
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| 11.16.2013, 09:05 AM |
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Saddletank
Miyazaki's Best Friend
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I can see how so many people think rain and or cold can cause you to catch a cold, but it actually doesn't. I think what NC was saying was why, in anime, does it often seem to and put the student in hospital or in bed at home for a day?
Arren, thanks for that link. That's really interesting, it seems the confession culture really is a standard dating behaviour, even an essential part of relationships being official. Fascinating.
Yes, the slice of toast in the mouth while running late for school is a good one. I think breakfast with the family (and family meals generally) are more common in Japanese households than in Britain. I've seen numerous anime where a character is late for school and just quickly gulps down a glass of juice or milk from the breakfast table while their meal is laid out for them (and another possible trope - it often seems to be a fried egg with a salad), meanwhile mother is washing up in the kitchen and father is sat eating/reading the paper but the child hasn't time to stop and runs off to school, so I think its based on the attitude that some food in the morning is good and healthy and you should eat no matter what, even if your are so late that your time for eating is actually zero.
I have a string of questions about another trope - after school clubs.
Why must the after school club our hero/heroine start or join be non-existent or have so few members its in danger of being closed by the student council? Is it true that clubs can be almost anything as long as they have at least 5 members? Why 5? Is that some magic number for social purposes?
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Isakaya High School Roleplaying Info
"An old man like me stands no chance fighting against a high school girl in her underwear" - Oshino Meme, Nekomonogatari (Kuro)
Post last edited by Saddletank on 11.16.2013, 10:17 AM.
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| 11.16.2013, 10:16 AM |
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arren18
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Registration Date: 08.15.06
Location: Edinburgh
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Not sure about the clubs honestly. I think the small numbers is just a matter of making it so that we can get to know all the characters in the club. And being in danger of getting shut down sets up plot points I suppose, even if that is therefore very generic.
Another thing about the breakfast trope - it's considered bad manners to eat while walking in Japan. So I suppose the idea is that somebody must be really late for class (and also different from the other people around them in some way) if they're eating their breakfast on the way to school.
And something that's true for a lot of these is that we keep seeing them because they're so common. If numerous stories feature the same means of establishing something about the protagonist, then of course it'll turn up all the time as a joke too.
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Post last edited by arren18 on 11.16.2013, 01:02 PM.
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| 11.16.2013, 12:59 PM |
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Mush
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Registration Date: 07.30.07
Location: South of Canada
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Not to be political in this thread, but visiting the hospital "four times as often as the average American" says very little about Japan. Americans visit the hospital anomalously infrequently, having among the world's highest healthcare costs and no universal coverage. A comparison with the average American will make anyone else in the developed world seem like a hypochondriac.
When it comes to the getting sick from rain trope, my guess is that because getting sick is essentially something that strikes at random, it's hard to work it into a storyline without it seeming like a Deus Ex Machina. You can't just have the love interest conveniently get sick at the right time to let our hero visit them in the hospital to prove their devotion. So the writers want some way of telling the audience that getting sick is a consequence of character choices and not something randomly decided for plot convenience, and maybe just having them get freezing cold is the easiest way to do that?
I guess it's not clear which anime tropes are common because they reflect Japanese culture, and which are common because they're a convenient way of telling a story. It also might go both ways; for example, Japan has the world's highest population of robots, which is probably reflected in the popularity of robot-themed anime, but also perhaps influenced by it (I know of several Japanese robotics professors who cite astro-boy as an inspiration). This sounds far-fetched, but perhaps little kids have started running to school with toast because that's what they do on TV? I agree with Arren that it's considered very crass behaviour to eat while walking in Japan.
But it's probably the kind of thing I would have done... ^^
The school clubs is an interesting one. Has anyone in the Tavern been on a high-school exchange to Japan? I strongly regret missing my chance to that in grade 12... It would be really interesting to find out how much holds true. I've heard that clubs are a bigger deal in Japan and participation is more strongly encouraged. In my high school, participation in extracurricular clubs was a very casual endeavour (unless coordinated practice was essential, like a sports team or theatre group). But I've heard that in Japan, participation in clubs is more common and skipping a club activity is really discouraged.
Speaking of student councils, it seems like they actually have some authority in Japanese schools? In my high school, the council was responsible for organizing dances and fundraisers and doing announcements on the comm... not much else, and nothing that could be considered as having decision-making authority over other students.
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Post last edited by Mush on 11.16.2013, 01:15 PM.
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| 11.16.2013, 01:13 PM |
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Saddletank
Miyazaki's Best Friend
Registration Date: 09.28.06
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Yes, its my understanding that student councils in schools have a good deal of influence and even establish rules, have powers over which clubs can be formed, manage the budgets for clubs and so on.
The students generally are given autonomy in lots of ways vs European school kids. There's that scene in Only Yesterday where an elementary school class is debating school rules about running in the hallways. I'm sure these activities re promoted by their teachers so as to build character and responsibility and prepare the kids for adulthood.
The elite, romantically unreachable, academically perfect student council president might be a trope.
__________________
Isakaya High School Roleplaying Info
"An old man like me stands no chance fighting against a high school girl in her underwear" - Oshino Meme, Nekomonogatari (Kuro)
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| 11.16.2013, 01:42 PM |
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Orphic Okapi
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Registration Date: 04.08.07
Location: Saskatchewan
Posts: 1335 |
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quote:
Originally posted by Mush
Not to be political in this thread, but visiting the hospital "four times as often as the average American" says very little about Japan. Americans visit the hospital anomalously infrequently, having among the world's highest healthcare costs and no universal coverage. A comparison with the average American will make anyone else in the developed world seem like a hypochondriac.
Oh, believe me, I know that American health care is an absolute mess. But I'm not sure that having a ludicrously expensive and inefficient health care system automatically translates into "people never visit the hospital." Most statistics I've found suggest that Americans visit the hospital about four times a year, which would mean the average Japanese person visits the hospital about sixteen times a year. Is that typical for developed countries other than America? Because it seems like an unusually high figure to me.
quote:
The school clubs is an interesting one. Has anyone in the Tavern been on a high-school exchange to Japan? I strongly regret missing my chance to that in grade 12... It would be really interesting to find out how much holds true. I've heard that clubs are a bigger deal in Japan and participation is more strongly encouraged. In my high school, participation in extracurricular clubs was a very casual endeavour (unless coordinated practice was essential, like a sports team or theatre group). But I've heard that in Japan, participation in clubs is more common and skipping a club activity is really discouraged.
Club activities are really important for middle and high school students. They are basically as mandatory as they can possibly be without technically being mandatory. I'm pretty sure all of my students are involved in a club, most of them being either on sports teams or in the school band. I was involved in extracurricular activities in middle school, too, but I knew plenty of kids who weren't, so it's a little different.
quote:
Speaking of student councils, it seems like they actually have some authority in Japanese schools? In my high school, the council was responsible for organizing dances and fundraisers and doing announcements on the comm... not much else, and nothing that could be considered as having decision-making authority over other students.
Is the absurdly powerful student council in Utena based to some degree on reality then? Utena's the only show I've seen where the cast revolves around the student council like that, so I was never sure if it was a trope. I think Touga definitely qualifies for Saddletank's "elite, romantically unreachable, academically perfect student council president" trope, although he also subverts it by being a playboy and manipulative creep.
I can't comment on whether the student council actually has the kind of power you describe, as I've never heard any of my students talk about it, or even heard any of them described as members.
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Post last edited by Orphic Okapi on 11.16.2013, 10:17 PM.
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| 11.16.2013, 07:25 PM |
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Saddletank
Miyazaki's Best Friend
Registration Date: 09.28.06
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Student Councils are fairly common in high school anime, if their functioning and deliberations are not specifically shown, they are frequently mentioned and the figure of the Council President is also commonly featured.
Kare Kano is one anime in which it features. Its also mentioned early in the series so watching the first half-dozen episodes will show what I'm referring to and you won't need to watch the whole show if its not your cup of tea.
Although its based on a harem computer game the show Amagami SS also features the school council and the council president.
President may not necessarily be a position of great power but it seems to command a good deal of respect.
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Isakaya High School Roleplaying Info
"An old man like me stands no chance fighting against a high school girl in her underwear" - Oshino Meme, Nekomonogatari (Kuro)
Post last edited by Saddletank on 11.16.2013, 10:08 PM.
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| 11.16.2013, 10:07 PM |
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arren18
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Registration Date: 08.15.06
Location: Edinburgh
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Clubs are pretty intense at university too. There are two different kinds of student groups - clubs and circles. Circles are relatively easy-going, though even that varies, and clubs are things you absolutely must attend because they take it completely seriously. I don't know much about the crazy-powerful student councils in anime/manga - another trope that comes up a lot as a joke by this point - but considering how hardcore clubs can be, I guess I can see how the student council in a school would be a big deal.
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| 11.16.2013, 10:58 PM |
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