Ghibli Tavern - Print: Is Everyone entitled to there opinion ?

Ghibli Tavern (http://www.onlineghibli.com/tavern/index.php)
|- General Discussions (http://www.onlineghibli.com/tavern/board.php?boardid=1)
|-- Is Everyone entitled to there opinion ? (http://www.onlineghibli.com/tavern/threadid.php?boardid=1&threadid=1302)

Posted by Howmany on 03.12.2007, 10:37 AM:

Is Everyone entitled to there opinion ?

yo so me and my buddy have been having a relativism debate and I thought you guys could help the socratic method. so as the title says is everyone entitled to there opinion on any given subject lets hear what ya sayin Online Ghibli.

__________________
Howmany ?

Posted by Miyrru on 03.12.2007, 11:05 AM:

yes they are, i am not anyone else and i cannot decide for them. if i dont like someone else's opinion there is nothing i can do to change it. mind you, i can voice displeasure about that opinion and if that person changes there opinion based on my disliking of it then they really didnt believe to strongly in there opinion.

__________________

Click for Gallery^^
The truth had to be seen. Anything else was a story, entertaining but more embroidered fib then crude, shapeless fact. ~Dave Eggers

Posted by Saddletank on 03.12.2007, 04:30 PM:

Of course they are, its a basic right. Even a man condemned to be executed for (say) a terrorist act that killed thousands may state his opinion on the terrorism laws.

__________________
Isakaya High School Roleplaying Info

"An old man like me stands no chance fighting against a high school girl in her underwear" - Oshino Meme, Nekomonogatari (Kuro)

Posted by Roarkiller on 03.13.2007, 12:48 AM:

An opinion is based on your own personal thoughts. It doesn't matter if you back it up with facts or statistics or whatnot, it still remains a personal thing.

And there's nothing wrong against that.

__________________
I am me.
I am who I am.
I am Roarkiller.
No one else is me.

Roarkiller.net
Isakaya High RPG Site

quote:
Originally posted by fenkashi
Screw your opinions, they are not relevant ^^.

Posted by Saddletank on 03.13.2007, 04:38 PM:

I'd love to hear the arguments from the side of the debating floor that says people should not entitled to an opinion.

Hm... this isn't a joke is it? A trick?

You didn't spell "there" that way deliberately did you? It should be "their"?

__________________
Isakaya High School Roleplaying Info

"An old man like me stands no chance fighting against a high school girl in her underwear" - Oshino Meme, Nekomonogatari (Kuro)

Posted by I-B4-E THUG on 03.14.2007, 06:53 AM:

mmmK.

I believe OTHER POEPLE are entitled to MY opinion, wheter they realise it or not.

cheers

Posted by Saddletank on 03.15.2007, 07:03 PM:

I take it back. I-B4-E THUG isn't entitled to an opinion.

__________________
Isakaya High School Roleplaying Info

"An old man like me stands no chance fighting against a high school girl in her underwear" - Oshino Meme, Nekomonogatari (Kuro)

Posted by foreignfilmfreak on 03.15.2007, 07:30 PM:

OH NO!!
MONSTERS!!
I'm not doing anymore things on opinions..
*hisses*Oh no you don't!! Learn how to
write an opinion by yourself and quit whining
you slackers!!*slams door*
Mu ha ha ha!
Yeah, I guess everyone can have their own opinion
on something. Just don't make me support my opinion
on an opinion EVER again..

Posted by emperor squirrel on 03.16.2007, 10:39 AM:

[QUOTE]Originally posted by I-B4-E THUG
mmmK.

I believe OTHER POEPLE are entitled to MY opinion, wheter they realise it or not. [end quote]

LOL thug, well put. and there you have your rebuttal to the Socratic ideal.

__________________

Posted by Howmany on 03.16.2007, 10:47 AM:

well im certianly amused by your answers.
so I'll play devils advocate

so if we are all entitled to our own opininons then you all happy to accept that someone Like Hitler can have the opinion that all people of certain religion or skin tone are sub human and should be sterlized, and that they are entitled to try to convince others of that opinion. or that I can hold the opinion that you are wrong on every given topic/idea. the orginal statement is a relativist one whcih would mean that there was no such thing as objective truth.

any misspellings are unintentional im not going for pulitzer or anything also im not bothered about the spellings either only when im writing properly does it count.

__________________
Howmany ?

Posted by arren18 on 03.16.2007, 12:13 PM:

Yes, somebody like Hitler is perfectly entitled to their own opinion, and can convince others this is correct if they like. If their opinions are like that though, we just have to hope that nobody will be persuaded.

__________________

Posted by foreignfilmfreak on 03.16.2007, 03:41 PM:

Hitler would hate me so I bet I'd have been the first to die.(no joke)Or he'd die from my extreme weirdness at beating him in everything.(seriously)
Weird, I've always been interested in the past and stuff.
But I'm never going to write an opinion in a long while..
My opinion od why Hitler would hate me. There's a story
about my Jewish aunt..It's very interesting to me.

Posted by Saddletank on 03.16.2007, 05:12 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Howmany
well im certianly amused by your answers.
so I'll play devils advocate

so if we are all entitled to our own opininons then you all happy to accept that someone Like Hitler can have the opinion that all people of certain religion or skin tone are sub human and should be sterlized, and that they are entitled to try to convince others of that opinion.

Hey, this is fun. Now we are getting down to the meat of it.

Sure Hitler can hold that opinion, in fact he did.

However the crux is your phrase "they are entitled to try to convince others of that opinion", that is a new addition to the discussion and at that point I would draw the line. All opinions are valid. Not all opinions are valid if put into practice. And certain opinions if put into practice should be resisted.

Currently here in the UK we are trying to deport certain religious preachers because their opinions breach the anti-terrorism laws by inciting racial hatred.

That's an opinion a person doesn't have the right to convince others is right.

You asked originally if it was a right of someone to hold an opinion, and it is. It isn't a right of a person to implement that opinion if said opinion infringes the rights of others (and in Hitler's case murdering them is a fairly serious infringement of their rights).

I'm not going to argue this down to degrees such as is it alright for me to implement my opinion that it's fine for me to have my radio really loud in my garden on Sunday afternoon. Going down that route leads to arguments of a different kind.

__________________
Isakaya High School Roleplaying Info

"An old man like me stands no chance fighting against a high school girl in her underwear" - Oshino Meme, Nekomonogatari (Kuro)

Posted by I-B4-E THUG on 03.16.2007, 11:34 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by emperor squirrel
[QUOTE]Originally posted by I-B4-E THUG
mmmK.

I believe OTHER POEPLE are entitled to MY opinion, wheter they realise it or not. [end quote]

LOL thug, well put. and there you have your rebuttal to the Socratic ideal.

wats the socratic ideal?

and hitlers case also involved torture.

cheers

Posted by Howmany on 03.17.2007, 11:09 AM:

well ok the question was is EVERYONE entitled to hold there opinion and by this I meant that they had the idea and where of course going around trying to convince people of its validity and agitating to get the authoritys to implement there ideas just like we do in real life.
ok hitler was an extreme example but what about the inmates at your local mental hosptial are they entitled to have there opinions and if yes why do we lock them up, apart from the obvious danger to society and themselves.
all opinions are NOT valid is not valid to belive thet 2+2=6 or any other illogical opinion.
well using a philosophical tool called:-
reductio ad absurdium-(reduce to abusrdity)
we can show that the position is invalid because whatever your opinion is, it is still valid for someone to hold the complete opisite opposed position.

@-THUG Well I think that squirrel means the socratic method rather than ideal and the socratic method is a dialectic method of inquiry usally using two people with one leading the disscussion that would be the thread starter and the others acceptng or rejecting a propistion put to them. for a complete description see wikipedia -(socratic method)

__________________
Howmany ?

Posted by Saddletank on 03.17.2007, 05:43 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Howmany
well ok the question was is EVERYONE entitled to hold there opinion and by this I meant that they had the idea and where of course going around trying to convince people of its validity and agitating to get the authoritys to implement there ideas just like we do in real life.

Ah, in this case your question now is a completely different one to the one you originally posed and now my answer is therefore no: not everyone is entitled to go around agitating to get the authorities to implement their ideas. See the example I gave above with regard to the racial hatred incitement by some preachers in the UK.

There are many wise and long standing laws in most nations that prevent agitation/lobbying for certain things - most of these being for reasons of state security and keeping the peace.

99.9% of opinions can be validly argued for and laws protect the interests of the majority. We do however need to watch out for the 0.1% of nutters who seek to pervert society by getting unjust or simply unethical laws passed.

Some people even create societies, cults, clubs or things like private militias which are not in societies best interests. However society lets them exist at a level where they do not threaten the majorities rights or basic civil liberties.

I can't answer your question in hypothetical terms, sorry, if its a purely philosophical debate you seek I can't help, because pure philosophical debate, while interesting isn't especially relevant (IMHO) IRL.

__________________
Isakaya High School Roleplaying Info

"An old man like me stands no chance fighting against a high school girl in her underwear" - Oshino Meme, Nekomonogatari (Kuro)

Posted by The Violin Maker on 03.18.2007, 12:11 AM:

Yes

__________________
-infinite is the soul

Posted by I-B4-E THUG on 03.18.2007, 06:19 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Howmany
@-THUG Well I think that squirrel means the socratic method rather than ideal and the socratic method is a dialectic method of inquiry usally using two people with one leading the disscussion that would be the thread starter and the others acceptng or rejecting a propistion put to them. for a complete description see wikipedia -(socratic method)

kool thanks Howmany

cheers